Curt Fisher

September 1, 2010September 1, 2010 Daniel Vance

Long-time Mankato developer, broker, and property manager has an uncanny ability to manage risk.

Forget nine, Curt Fisher has nine hundred lives.

He has badly wrecked a BSA motorcycle, lost altitude and crashed a power parachute onto a Blue Earth County park pavilion, navigated the dangerously rocky Blue Earth River perhaps hundreds of times on a jet ski, sailed across the rough Atlantic Ocean in a sailboat, and barely survived his antique steam engine flipping over before a North Mankato parade. And we’re just getting started.

Like Evel Knievel, Fisher survives calamity yet another day. He thinks fast on his feet.

This trait has marked his business career, too. When others can’t survive risky or seemingly unworkable business projects, Fisher somehow can.

In semi-retirement, Fisher now has only a minority interest in Coldwell Banker Commercial Fisher Group, the three-division entity with brokerage, development, and property management arms. The brokerage he founded has been Greater Mankato’s largest commercial real estate company and the company’s property management wing manages more than one million square feet of space. The third arm, Fisher Development, has developed projects like Aacker’s Business College and Federal Express in Fargo, Rasmussen College in St. Cloud, a USBank corporate facility in Marshall, and Old Main Village, Midwest Wireless, and River City Centre East in Mankato.

In 2000, Fisher and a partner purchased the Blue Tang Inn in Belize, Central America. Then about three years ago, he completed perhaps his most visible and complex business project: the one that gifted Downtown Mankato in 2007 with a nine-story, 118-room Hilton Garden Inn and a skyline befitting a metropolitan area.

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Share your family background.
My father lived through the Depression and in his early years worked plowing snow for the highway department. In order to make ends meet, he started Fisher Radio and TV, an RCA dealership and repair facility. That’s how he met my mother, while making a house call to fix her parents’ radio. Then, he moved to Hennepin County Highway Department and ultimately became head of traffic and safety. He had a staff of engineers, was president of the Institute of Traffic Engineers—an international organization—and did it all without a full college education. He had to have engineers sign off on projects because he wasn’t an engineer. My mom was always the go-getter, fun to be around. She is 97 and wants to live to be 100.

I’ve heard you are half-Jewish and didn’t find out until you were in college.
My father was Jewish. He met my mother, a Norwegian, who wasn’t Jewish. (Laughter.) Some in his family couldn’t accept the relationship. I didn’t know anything about it because what happened was never discussed in our home. I chose my own church and was baptized at a Lutheran church in Robbinsdale. Debbie and I joined Centenary United Methodist in Mankato in the early ‘70s.

They could not accept the relationship?
It is interesting now thinking that when relatives came to visit I didn’t know they were relatives. I thought they were family friends. My father was pretty much separated from the rest of his family and as a result of his marriage to my mother was asked to release any interest he may have in my grandmother’s estate. This insulted him and further alienated a family relationship.

While attending MSU, friends asked if I had any Jewish heritage. I mentioned it to my mother one day at the dinner table. I said it was funny some friends thought I had a Jewish heritage. Then there was a long silence. My mother looked at my father, then me, and said, “That’s because your father is Jewish.”

It worked to empower me. Suddenly, there was something in my blood—so to speak—that I hadn’t been aware of and I decided was a good thing. It was a startling experience. My mother was protective of her children. For some reason, she was concerned we would be looked upon differently if others knew and she never shared the information until that moment. That had been her way of showing her love.

You attended Minnesota State?
I met my future wife there when I was a 17-year-old freshman in 1966. I attended through my junior year and enjoyed economics classes, but never finished. I went into real estate and took some courses I found really exciting, which led to my becoming a Certified Commercial Investment Member (CCIM). Earning that designation gave me the skills—the tools in the toolbox—to help me process opportunities. I have always been about opportunities and risk.

In our interview 12 years ago, you explained how you got your seed money to begin your career. You were riding a BSA motorcycle one day when….
I was involved in a motorcycle accident in which a car took a left turn in front of me. I didn’t have a chance to avoid it. I was injured and was able to settle for some funds—not a large amount—but it was enough for me to buy some houses on contract for deed with $1,000 down. Owning them was an opportunity for me to learn about managing and making real estate work financially. It was valuable experience.

You are a risk taker. You jet ski up the rocky Blue Earth River to work sometimes, you have flown a power parachute almost to your death near the Rapidan Dam, and you sailed a sailboat across the Atlantic Ocean. What about risk thrills you?
I have trust in my ability to find the safest solution—an escape—in financial situations or in doing something physical such as sailing or power parachuting. I’m certainly not looking for dangerous hobbies or business deals. I’m conservative but always looking for risk-taking opportunities. I analyze and am proud of my financial ability to create value and a solution to enhance a project or make it work. This excites me. The more the challenge and the more I can find the solution, the better I feel about what I’ve done. Similarly, from a physical perspective, I’m generally able to find alternatives to minimize danger.

Such as? What was the one thing you were thinking about when you said that?
I was thinking of flying with Debbie in an airplane to go skiing with the kids. When we encountered icing and I was unable to hold altitude, we had an emergency situation. I was able to safely land the plane in a blizzard in a farm field. I didn’t panic. I feel I can find ways to react when and if the need arises. That said, I don’t want situations like that to occur. In the future, I hope my life will be calmer, but still fun. In business challenges, I have confidence I’ll be able to find solutions where there may not be obvious ones. However, an incident like with what recently happened with the power parachute wasn’t something I felt was dangerous or was expecting to happen.

The power parachute that crashed near the Rapidan Dam. What exactly happened?
I chose not to fly an ultra-light but rather a power parachute because if the engine failed in the latter I would still have a parachute and be able to safely land. This particular power parachute was brand new and had a four-stroke rather than a two-stroke engine.

My younger son Dain came out on Memorial Day. I wanted to take him up in the new power parachute. It was a gorgeous day, beautiful blue sky, not a speck of wind. I have an ideal landing and take-off strip on our property. While we were flying above the Blue Earth River, a bald eagle soared in front of us. We followed it. Then I began turning at the Dam Store to return home. I felt a lurch and we started dropping to the right. I looked in the mirror and saw the power parachute wasn’t inflated properly. I gave it full throttle and tried to steer to a safe area. Broken lines on the parachute had caused half the wing to fold up and lose lift. That put us into an uncontrollable spin, but we managed to avoid a lot of danger around the dam. We went through a few trees and clipped the county pavilion and landed on our wheels. We walked away from it, amazingly.

In a 2007 Minneapolis St. Paul Business Journal interview, you said, “When I started there was just one regional mall and there weren’t many regional players or risk takers. It was just local people in companies making investments within our own market.” Since 1972, when you started your business, could you name three major business risks you have taken?
Sure. One is in Marshall, Minnesota. It involved a large building about the size of the former Midwest Wireless facility. I was the primary owner. The challenge was it was in Marshall and knowing that if the user of the building, USBank, chose not to renew its lease, I would be in a very difficult situation. It was a competitive project because of its size and several large regional firms submitted proposals. I structured a proposal that minimized the risk and worked with the user and I was awarded the project. We have since expanded that building 25,000 sq. ft. and extended their lease. It has become a successful project. I was able to make that project work primarily because I wasn’t as afraid as larger metro developers of taking a risk in southwestern Minnesota. I understood the situation and was able to control it because of how I was able to structure the lease.

Another example, one I feel saddened at its failure, involved a Mankato start-up called Phenix Biocomposites. I was approached as a consultant to develop the Phenix Biocomposites plant. When the company ran low on funds, and to keep the project going, along with others I invested funds, even though that wasn’t what we were initially brought in for. They continued to have difficulty. We then invested more. We had confidence in the decision makers and management team because they were very optimistic and were introducing a new green product that not only was good environmentally, but also created value for area farmers. Our investing in that company became emotional. It wasn’t just business. That’s when it became high-risk. The interest became more than financial because I believed in the idea of taking residue from farm fields and creating value with a commodity and the products they were making.

Wasn’t that product first called MollyBoard?
It started with MollyBoard, and ultimately became Environ. It was a difficult investment for me because I veered off the way I’d normally look at a project. The more time I had in the project, the more presentations to farmers and other organizations I attended, the more I listened to the management team, and the more money I invested, the harder it was to be objective. It was a good learning experience and taught me to be more cautious in terms of expanding my role. As it turned out, the company did start, did produce product, and within months, failed.

While the company was in bankruptcy, my partner and good friend, Bruce Paradis, called and said, “Maybe we should look at getting the company out of bankruptcy in court.” I’m thinking, “Why would I get into this?” We both liked the idea of a company successfully producing this product line and trusted and enjoyed our relationship with the farmer-based board and investors. I met with the company president and asked him that if we could eliminate the debt, could he make the business work. He said yes. We then negotiated a secured position, becoming the first claimant on the company taking over that debt. We started the company and three months later it failed again. Now we were the primary owners and had a large distressed manufacturing facility with a tremendous investment in specialized equipment that didn’t work.

So it failed a second time.
That was also emotional. We were able to liquidate and keep the plant here without it being sold off into bits and pieces. It was a big disappointment for the company not to succeed in its original vision. After that, we didn’t have confidence in the management team and asked my son Derek to become interim president until we could sell it to a new buyer. We totally sold out five years ago and the plant now is making a commodity.

The farmers in part brought us to the company. They put their hearts and financial assets into it and were such honest people. I wanted it to succeed for them. It was disappointing for us not to be able to do it. We are still friends with many of them.

A third project?
A difficult project was what became Old Main Village in Mankato. It was difficult saving it and also making it into a retirement community. It took four years of hard work. Sen. Rudy Boschwitz carried it through Congress and had Old Main exempted in the Tax Reform Act of 1986. Old Main was written into the National Register. It required the commitment of the development team and involved seniors when funds to keep the process going fell short.

Could you describe the different divisions of Fisher Group and your exit strategy for each?
Fisher Group is made up of three entities: It’s a brokerage company, a management company, and a development company.
Today, Fisher Group is affiliated with Coldwell Banker Commercial Real Estate and has grown in its regional brokerage/management role. But here was the challenge. Because of my leadership and involvement as principal over the years, I was the face of the company. The question was how could I leave a service-based company and have it continue without me. Therein lies the challenge of an exit strategy for a service-based business. In many ways, my company was perceived as me. When I left, what would happen? It didn’t make sense for the company not to continue, especially with a solid reputation, client base, knowledge, and great employees.

As an exit strategy, I gave ownership to three people in the company and they became majority owners. I became a minority owner. The three: David Schooff, president/ceo, who was brought in to oversee the three companies; Teri Goebel, who operates the management side; and Larry Forsythe, the development side. Unfortunately, we had to buy out Larry when he had health problems.

I mentored them for a couple years. Today, I’m much less involved in day-to-day functions because they are capable of running the business. In addition to these three entities, Fisher Group has a jointly owned development arm that can own and develop projects separate from my ownership. Today, I’m there when they need me. I stay involved in select projects in which I can make a major contribution via my experience or knowledge.

Name the last one you helped out on?
The last one I was significantly involved in and is completed is the Hilton in Downtown Mankato.

Take us through the entire deal that helped bring it to downtown Mankato.
As an investor in our community, and a risk taker, I was curious about the potential feasibility of this project when it was on the table. I was monitoring it, but as you recall, the developer of the project continued asking for extensions because he was unable to meet targets in his development schedule. This made me suspicious of the challenges he was facing and whether the project was even feasible. I visited with the City a couple times about how the project was coming. I knew it was important to the City of Mankato to bring more beds to downtown to help the Civic Center be viable and compete with other cities. I met with the developer when he was missing his final deadline.

Why did he fail?
As I see it, the developer was looking to create value in the project through contributed equity via his services. It wasn’t cash; it was basically his value position being converted to ownership, which diluted the balance of the ownership left for the remaining owners. Therefore, financing became difficult, and the developer brought in a guarantor with a strong financial statement to guarantee a bank loan. But the guarantor wanted a significant equity position without investing cash. This diluted it further. It was highly leveraged. There was too much phantom equity and the actual cash investors’ interest was diluted. The investment into this type of investment involves more risk and requires significant investment by the ownership interests in order to have a chance to succeed.

Like a house of cards.
More or less. Although they might have found a bank to take the loan based on the guarantee, the investors were at the bottom end, and it had high risk, was highly leveraged, and had a low opportunity for success. The cash was diluted significantly.

My understanding is the City put in $1.6 million toward this $13 million project. Do you think the City today believes this was a good spend on their part?
The City’s investment was mainly for infrastructure. They ended up getting a direct connection from the Civic Center to the parking ramp. We gave up a half floor of rooms and built, at our expense, a hallway to connect the Civic Center to the parking garage. So we lost a half floor of revenue opportunity. They have a permanent easement on that hallway. If you look at what they have done for other projects, for example, when the Holiday Inn was being built, the City built the ramp under it. They provided the land, utilities, and infrastructure. This was on a much larger scale. Recently, they helped build the skywalk connecting the Holiday Inn to the Civic Center. I believe the City has come out well, considering the investment we put in to build it, the tax revenue it generates, and a walkway with which they have an easement. This investment would not have happened in Downtown Mankato without the City’s commitment.

How did you come into owning the Blue Tang Inn in Belize?
In 1992, Lee Carlstrom’s brother had gone to a hotel in Belize and suggested Lee and I check it out as a vacation spot. It was Rock’s Inn, on the beach, and we had a wonderful time. Over an eight-year period, we kept going and invited other friends. Eventually, the local owner was having a difficult time with his other businesses. The hotel was becoming run down, to the point it wasn’t even adequate or comfortable for us to stay there anymore. We knew the manager well and asked if the owner would like to sell.

We ended up buying it for a little less than $1 million and completed a major renovation. It had 14 suites. Two weeks after buying it, Hurricane Mitch devastated the island. In all the years we had gone there, there hadn’t been a hurricane. We didn’t even have insurance on it yet. We did a total renovation over the next year. My son Dain bought windows from Lindsay Windows in North Mankato, loaded them onto a truck, and drove that truck to Florida to ship the windows to Belize.

What do you like about the people in Belize?
From 1992-2000, we built wonderful friendships. The people there were like family. We would celebrate their birthdays and bring presents. These were locals we knew through experiences like diving, sailing or fishing. They were so friendly and nice. It was natural to want to go back. Then we purchased it and changed the name to Blue Tang Inn. We bought it with the understanding that it may not necessarily be the best investment. Bruce and I thought it would be special to our family and friends and I can’t believe how many Mankatoans and fiends have stayed at the Blue Tang Inn. We have great employees that manage and care for it. Our daughter Kristin manages the reservations here in Mankato.

Besides being a former MSU Foundation board member, and on the College of Business Advisory Council, you are personal friends with MSU President Richard Davenport. What kind of man is he?
(Laughter.) In some ways, he’s like me. He’s a risk taker and wants to use his abilities to improve his professional commitments. He has a vision for the University he believes will help position it for the future and continue its success for students and community. While I’m able to make decisions that involve the future of my company, he has a public perspective and carefully planned process to follow on everything he does. I respect his commitment and feel he has been very good for the University and Mankato.

But I asked you about what kind of man he is?
Oh boy. (Laughter.) Dick has a wonderful sense of humor. He’s socially involved and enjoys people and will find a way to make a prank here and there on his friends. In fact, he may have done that with me on a few occasions. My response to his latest prank on me was I delivered a load of mulch in my dump truck and dumped it in front of his garage doors. I didn’t realize he was home at the time. I would have enjoyed seeing him dig out.

From your viewpoint, how would a new Walmart distribution center change the face of Mankato and the entire region?
My expectation is it will enhance our role as a distribution warehouse marketplace for other regional distributors. Jobs are good and something communities hope to attract. Having their facility here would put us on the radar screen with similar regional companies. Our transportation system has hurt us in the past by not having a direct connection to I-35. Having the new bridge in the area connecting Highway 14 directly to the Walmart site makes the area much more desirable for other regional distribution facilities.

When I interviewed Mankato developer Mike Drummer in 2007, he said, “If the corner down on Highway 14 and County Road 3 could land a big company, on land Fisher Development owns, growth in that area could accelerate.” You own more than 40 acres there. Would a Walmart distribution center in town make that land more valuable?
Mike is right, however, the land will likely be a combination of big box users, mixed development, smaller retail, and freestanding facilities. We have developed a market strategy and completed preliminary designs and layout. We’ve sent information to large retailers. We had a positive response until the recession came and the principle tenants we were working with withdrew from the market. It will happen eventually, though. It’s a great site.

Your commercial real estate business used to be called Fisher and Lidstrom. Now Tim Lidstrom competes with one of your three businesses. What happened?
An inherent condition in this industry is the desire for people involved to become independent. It’s not abnormal. It’s normal. It happens all the time. Tim was successful in what he did for our office and we appreciated his accomplishments. But it was time for him to go on his own. I understand it.

Do you still own farmland?
We sold our farms, but I’ve always been interested in farming, in the lifestyle, the ethics of farming, how everyone on a family farm works together as a family.

Farming can be a risky business.
It can be very risky. What I find especially intriguing is the large equipment used in farming, which led me to acquire farm antiques. I was able for several years to work during harvest. I also enjoyed attending old farm auctions. There is something about the mystique of standing in certain farm buildings and imagining how those buildings served that farm over its life. They always had a tool shed and they never threw anything away. I would look at equipment and it would fascinate me to envision what the equipment had done during its life.
I enjoy history, such as older farms, houses, and the Mankato train depot. At the depot there was an old crawl space. I crawled in once and found ledgers dating back to the early 1900s. I saw passenger tickets and books with many prominent Mankato names and where they went.

Most people enjoying history tend not to be risk takers. One looks at the past; the other, the future. Normally you don’t find that combination in a person.
If taking a history class at the university, I probably wouldn’t do well, especially with memorization. But if I can touch history, if I can see its place and how it performed—that is of greater interest.

You have spoken to college classes on the topic of entrepreneurship. What are the qualities of a great entrepreneur?
Being involved and respected as a leader and having high ethical standards and a commitment to clients. An entrepreneur shouldn’t be self-serving but rather committed to the people around him and a risk taker in a way that enhances the opportunity for those around him.
I’ve been a risk taker and thoughtfully taken risks. The types of risk I take now are different than when I was young. Back then, the challenge of completing most any risk in my profession was exciting, i.e., completing a financial transaction, making it work for everyone, and being rewarded. But now, it’s more about accomplishing something bigger. For example, the hotel in Downtown Mankato was a major risk I didn’t need to take. But it could have a broad impact on the community. So there was more to that decision than financial.

During your trip to South Africa, and right before you sailed across the ocean, you were quoted in the Mankato daily newspaper as saying, “After seeing the hardships endured in life in other countries, it gave me an appreciation for our country and Mankato.“ What other insight did you gain?
I compared their lives to mine. I appreciate the life we have, but I’m not sure I fully understand it. When seeing the way people there lived, I realized I could live with less and be happy. When I came back and saw how much we have, and how much we seemed to struggle at times, it seemed so relative.

Besides the investments we talked about, what else are you involved in?
I’m more involved now in maintaining my portfolio. As an independent business owner, I don’t have a retirement pension. I have residual investments created during my professional career.

As for investments, one relationship that started in Mankato was FedEx. A Minneapolis development company was trying to do the North Mankato FedEx project, but it was too small to be economically feasible for them. So they turned it over to me. I developed it and went on to develop other FedEx projects. I sold the FedEx buildings and maintain ones in St. Cloud and at Duluth International Airport. This grew out of a relationship from 20 years ago and I’m still able to enjoy it today.

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Getting to know you: Curt Fisher

Born: November 24, 1948, in Minneapolis.

Education: 1966, Robbinsdale High School, attended Minnesota State.

Family: Wife Debbie, children Derek, Kristin, and Dain; and grandchildren Katherine, Lizzie, Charlie, and Hazel.

Professional and community involvement: Mankato Area Sesquicentennial Committee, co-chair; Greater Mankato Area Chamber Business Hall of Fame, member; Active Community Thought for 2000, chair; Minnesota State University Foundation, former board member; Minnesota State College of Business Advisory Council, member; Minnesota Building Owners and Managers Association, Mankato delegate; Twin Valley Council Boy Scouts of America.